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MM,

The war on religion is getting worse.

Thanks for posting that and the pictures. This should make national news.

I would hope that everyone would condemn such actions. Especially our Catholic president and his entire cabinet and staff.

Jim

01/23/21 12:34 AM

#8880

Sick ! Sad ! And disgusting !

01/23/21 10:05 AM

#8881

Peggy Southworth (Townley)

MM, I think you’re offering this up as an example of people on my side of the fence behaving badly, and I would have to agree with you, Jim and Dave. Such behavior is utterly unconscionable.

The only disagreement I have is I don’t think there is a “war on religion”.

01/23/21 11:20 AM

#8882

Dave Mitchell- I didn't know Hank Aaron passed until I read your post. He was talented and brave. My great-uncle was a pro baseball player and manager. Billy Southworth. He played for several pro teams and as manager, took them to World Series. Boston Braves and St. Louis Cardinals. He made his home in Sunbury, Ohio. His kitchen floor had a large, round, cardinal in the middle. I loved going out to visit him. Dad was the baseball enthusiast but I loved Uncle Bill's horses! And he had quite a few. Uncle Bill's daughter, my cousin, Carole Jean put me atop a live horse for the very first time. I was maybe three years old. It was love at first sight and I never looked back. Uncle Bill also had a few toboggan sleds and I recall going to his place in the winter when it snowed. There was a good hill across from the house and the family would gather to enjoy sledding! It was so much fun. Aunt Mabel stayed in the house where it was warm. They also had a couple dachshund dogs. Uncle Bill's property was extensive and also had a creek through it. Dad, Uncle Bill, Grandpa and probably cousins would take the dogs hunting on the property. Mom learned how to shoot firearms on the property too. Many good memories. Blessed.

01/23/21 11:34 AM

#8883

This is an interesting segment of a story today about Larry King, who just died at the age of 87.It points out a shift in mass media programming that we have come to take for granted. Info outlets began overtly taking sides years ago, setting us on a course that led to where we find ourselves today as information presentation became more and more shrill and divisive, because: money. And now, here we are, in what I think we can safely call an argumentative culture. Just in case you ever stop and wonder can't we all just get along? part of the reason is that media outlets make money out of stirring everybody up. Some more than others. That has always been the case to a degree, of course. It's just far more pervasive and overt now that ever. It's interesting to look back and see how it got this way to the point where we now live in a "loud news century." In a way it's good for democracy. In a way it's not.

Anyway, RIP Hank Aaron and RIP Larry King. At least THEY'VE got some peace and quiet.

Larry King died in 2010. Not for real, but when CNN pulled the plug on King’s show after 25 years, it felt like a dress rehearsal for the real cancellation.

King was 77 when his run ended at the network. He told me he could see it coming. Cable news had changed. It had become all about shouting, the left-versus-right paradigm and ‘‘good TV’’ — meaning spectacles. Fox News had gone right, and MSNBC had lurched left, and somewhere in the shrinking American middle was the once-dominant CNN, adrift in a loud new century.

01/23/21 02:45 PM

#8884

I sent this email to a bunch of guys, including some on this Forum. So forgive me the repetion guys (you know who you are). And apologies for the repeated theme them here on the Forum, but I enjoyed Peggy's Story so much I thought this would fit in with the some fun memories from back in the day.

------------------------

Baseball.

Hank Aaron was one of my all-time favorite players. I was a teenager in Columbus Ohio in the 60’s and crazy about baseball. The first time I got my own ball glove (about age 7 as I recall) I actually took it to bed with me.

I watched the “Game of the Week” every Saturday on TV with Dizzy Dean and Pee Wee Reece announcing.

I had a favorite player - Ernie Banks of the Cubs. But I also loved Hank Aaron.

And I loved and Mickey Mantle and Willy Mays, and Harmon Killebrew, and Rocky Colavito.

And I LOVED watching great pitchers, so I worshipped Sandy Koufax and Bob Gibsen.

I got to see Hank Aaron play twice, once in Milwaukee and once in Atlanta. When I saw him in Milwaukee, they played the Cubs, so I was getting to watch Ernie Banks play against Hank Aaron in the same game.

It doesn't’ get much better than that!

(Well, watching Herb Score pitch for Cleveland against Whitey Ford (Yankees) - in my first ever big league game - with John Jackson - comes close.)

In Columbus we had a minor league team, the Columbus Jets, AAA farm club for the Pittsburgh Pirates. And back then they played in an old stadium in an old industrial part of town. The stadium was known as - - wait for it - - “Jet Stadium”.

(It had once been “Redbird Stadium" and later became “Clippers” Stadium named for each of the team franchises). The Clippers were the last one in the old stadium when later we became Yankees AAA club, so George Steinbrenner would show up from time to time - occasionally un-escorted and un-announced - to watch the younger guys play.

I have a fun memory of one Sunday afternoon game at Jet Stadium. My Dad took me out to see a game and we had seats way down the first base line, out in shallow right field. I wanna say it was against the Rochester “Red Birds” (with a young chubby red-head first-baseman named “Boog Powell).

I was telling Dad about this new rookie right-fielder standing not far out in front of us. He was a big barrel-chested Black guy who had just come up from Asheville in the AA league. He was going to be a good one I told Dad. The sports newspapers said he was so promising that “he might not last the summer in Columbus - on his way up to Pittsburgh”.

The first hitter for Rochester hit a routine fly ball out our way and this new kid only needed to take a few steps before he could simply camp under the ball - which he did - and the ball popped into, and right out of the center of his glove. Error - man on base.

The next hitter hit an almost identical fly ball and we watched the ”new kid” stand under it and let it hit the center of his glove. Any yes, dropped it - again!

So Dad turns two me and says, “Your’e right. I don’t think he will “last the summer here in Columbus."

In fact he didn’t. But not as Dad had predicted. By mid-summer he had been “called up” to Pittsburg, where he stayed for about 18 years.

Oh by the way, the kid’s name was Willy Stargell.

As we look back on Hank Aaron’s carreer. It brings a certain fond memory. But it was his character in the face of all that racist hatred that makes him so much greater than just a magnificent baseball player.

We’ve come through a year that makes his challenged life stand out as reminder of how broken and backward we are as a nation. And how much we need God’s healing Grace.

Don’t ya wish we had a million 'Hammerin’ Henrys’?

But we only got one - so maybe our Creator is asking each of us to ”pitch in”.

01/23/21 03:45 PM

#8885

Used to listen to Jets games at night, under the covers with a tiny plastic radio.

01/23/21 04:34 PM

#8886

Mary Margaret Clark (Schultheis)

Do any of you Jets baseball fans remember those big, circular, metal "Junior Jet" badges we kids could wear on our shirts so as to get into the games for fifty cents (or was it free?) when accompanied by a parent?

Also, do you remember that hole in the centerfield fence that if a batter hit the ball through it he would win big $$$ (I can't recall the exact amount, maybe $10,000)?

Jim

01/23/21 05:27 PM

#8887

John, I shared the news of the protest at the Cathedral because I felt it newsworthy to members of the Forum as it happened in the city where we all grew up. Please make no assumpttions.

01/23/21 06:54 PM

#8888

MM, assumptions or not, the behavior by the protesters you described was deplorable in every sense.

01/23/21 10:17 PM

#8889

John J. et al,

Since we are still on the topic of the Cathedral invasion in Columbus:

I am glad we can once again agree to disagree. Perhaps the term "war on religion" was a bit too bold and maybe the word "attacks" would be more appropriate, since a war usually requires some kind of declaration. But, then again, all the wars that America has fought since WWII have been undeclared by Congress. And wars are usually fought by a series of attacks and battles.

It seems obvious to me that organized religion, especially Catholicism, Evangelical Christians and others who adhere to Judeo-Christian values are subject to mockery, ridicule and disdain from those who do not agree with the tenents and beliefs of those who are members of such faiths.

Am I alone in this way of thinking? I would like to hear from other classmates if they think religion is under attack.

Jim

01/23/21 11:06 PM

#8890

I think the country is getting more diverse in terms of belief systems.

And statistics indicate that church attendance has ebbed.

But millions still worship and no one is stopping them.

And the government sanctioned tax breaks for churches are firmly in place.

If there is a war it's a rhetorical/political one. That phrase itself, "war on religion" goes back several years in that regard.

There has, however, been a troubling spate of vandelism and attacks on mosques, synagogues, and churches, including one close at hand down here where a crazy man drove his car into the catholic church where my girlfriend's aunt worships.

Overall, in spite of the increasing diversity of spirituality and humanistic perspectives in this country, I'd say there's still a greater cultural stigma about being an atheist than there is about being devout and affiliated with a belief otherwise in our culture. I've seen the "secular humanism" descriptor used as a derogatory on this site and wondered to myself what's so bad about either one of those outlooks.

Finally, I'd be interested to see how Biden's devout Catholicism - his version of it, at least - becomes a political football over the next four years. Be nice if the pope comes for a visit during his term.

From a recent analysis:

"There are myriad changes with the incoming Biden administration. One of the most significant: a president who has spent a lifetime steeped in Christian rituals and practices.

Mr. Biden, perhaps the most religiously observant commander in chief in half a century, regularly attends Mass and speaks of how his Catholic faith grounds his life and his policies.

And with Mr. Biden, a different, more liberal Christianity is ascendant: less focused on sexual politics and more on combating poverty, climate change and racial inequality.

His arrival comes after four years in which conservative Christianity has reigned in America’s highest halls of power, embodied in white evangelicals laser-focused on ending abortion and guarding against what they saw as encroachments on their freedoms. Their devotion to former President Donald J. Trump was so fervent that many showed up in Washington on Jan. 6 to protest the election results.

Mr. Biden’s leadership is a repudiation of the claim by many conservative leaders that Democrats are inherently anti-Christian."

01/24/21 06:35 AM

#8891

Read The New Yorker’s complete news coverage and analysis of the coronavirus pandemic.

One more interesting clip from the news feed. Get your shots folks. Getting my first injection tomorrow.

"sars-CoV-2 had been remarkably stable as it coursed around the world, being so well adapted to the human host. This stability allowed the development of vaccines that are finely targeted for vulnerable regions of the virus’s spike protein. In February, 2020, a new variant emerging from Italy proved to be more infectious than the original Wuhan variant. Scientists were on guard, expecting an assault of new mutations. “We were getting sequencing up and running” to detect new variants, Gregory Armstrong, the director of the Advanced Molecular Detection program at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, told me. “Then for ten months, it was crickets.”

Last September, just as the first vaccine candidates were undergoing their Phase III trials, an aggressive new variant began circulating in southeast England, centered in Kent, along the highway from London to Dover. On Halloween, England announced a monthlong lockdown, which was dramatically successful in curbing the spread of covid-19 in other parts of the country, but not in the Kent corridor. There were already a number of distinct variants of the novel coronavirus, with a few genetic variations of little consequence. But the U.K. variant, initially labelled a “Variant Under Investigation,” contained twenty-three different mutations, including several on the spike protein; moreover, it was rapidly driving out competitors and becoming the predominant virus in the country, especially among younger people. On December 18th, it was upgraded to a “Variant of Concern.”

What made the U.K. variant so much more successful than the original virus? One possibility is pure chance. It could have been amplified through some superspreader event, like the variant that took root at an employee conference at the Boston biotech firm Biogen, in February, 2020, which eventually accounted for more than three hundred thousand infections. Or perhaps it got seeded in a school or a church, and spread rapidly among a tightly knit population. But, as researchers went back and studied the growth of the U.K. variant’s mutations through serum samples, they realized that neither of these hypotheses could account for the accelerated pace of the spread. “Some mathematicians modelled how the variant has spread, and they found it was between forty and seventy per cent more infectious,” John Brooks, the chief medical officer at the Centers for Disease Control’s covid-19 Emergency Response, told me. The current hypothesis is that the Kent variant, now called B.1.1.7, has a mutation that switched an amino acid in the spike protein, allowing it to bind more tightly to the body’s ace2 receptors. “That means it takes less virus to infect you,” Brooks said. “That tighter binding also means that it can replicate more efficiently.” Once infected with the new variant, a person will be shedding more virus than someone infected with another variant. “It’s a wicked cycle,” Brooks observed. B.1.1.7 quickly spread to dozens of countries. The ongoing mystery is why it is not more fatal, given its increased viral load. It may be just a matter of luck.

01/24/21 09:54 AM

#8892

Jim, you and I have disagreed strenuously on political matters but I would never in any way mock or criticize you for taking your Catholicism seriously. But it does surprise me that you seem to think your political outlook is the only one compatible with Catholicism given the fact that there are many, many devout Catholics (among them my own sister Liz, a Dominican nun, and our current pope) who take a very different view.

01/24/21 10:37 AM

#8893

John,

Wow, I do not recall that I ever said that those with other political views do not take their Catholicism seriously. However, when high profile figures profess publically support for something as serious as abortion, I do believe that they are treading on shaky ground.

That being said, there is no excuse for attacks on religions and people who adhere to Catholic and Christian teachings.

Jim

01/24/21 12:03 PM

#8894

Joseph Gentilini

Regarding the issue as to whether religion is under attack in this country, I do not believe it is. In fact, I believe the evangelical and conservative churches are impinging on my rights as a gay man.

However.....what occurred at st. Joseph's Cathedral in Columbus was wrong. If these individuals believe so strongly in their position of being pro-choice, that is their right to object, work to make changes, etc., through the pollitical process. But once they try to disrupt others who do not share their beliefs, especially in a church, etc., they have stepped over a line I do not support.

01/24/21 12:59 PM

#8895

I'm hoping they charge those guys with something. Trespassing at the very least.

Or maybe they already have. I hope. Wouldn't ordinarily want to punch a guy in the nose in church but in this case I'd make an exception.

Nope just checked the dispatch. Cops came and ran them out but no charges judging from the story I saw. Yet.

01/24/21 02:14 PM

#8896

Jim, I totally accept that there is absolutely “no excuse for attacks on religions and people who adhere to Catholic and Christian teachings”. And if your main concern in this discussion is about abortion, I completely respect that also. But people who take their Catholicism/Christianity (or other religion) seriously come down on many other issues in many different places. And if others take issue with the positions they take, that should not be interpreted as an attack on their religion.

01/25/21 12:19 PM

#8897

Jim: You asked for a report about any after-effect of my covid 19 shot this morning and I thought I'd answer you here rather than via email, and flesh it out in terms of the whole experience in case anyone else is interested.

I thought I was going to get Moderna but they had switched to Pfizer. Fine by me.

It was quite the spectacle, the whole affair - not sure what the staging of this thing has been like elsewhere, but the operation down here in Orlando may well be the largest in the country. It is at the massive ghost town called the Orange County Convention Center. I say ghost town because conveniently, the convention business is zilch, thanks to the virus, so we had the run of the place. There was plenty of room on the grounds for hundreds of cars to line up, surely at least a thousand on the winding roads around the center, leading to the massive garage beneath it where our shots awaited us.

First traffic jam in my life I was grateful to be a part of.

I had made an appointment via an internet site weeks ago. You had to have one, you couldn't just show up, and they had people posted at points along the road to confirm everybody's name and info via a verification stamp they had emailed out to us. This was only for folks over 65 so it was a pretty crusty looking crowd. The line of cars moved slowly enough and stood still long enough that now and then an old codger or two got caught napping and had to be roused. We all stayed in our cars through the whole thing, start to finish, and got our shots through the windows of our cars, after answering a few check-in questions, when we got to the garage underneath the convention center.

Really well organized. Tracking every individual and every shot -- somewhere in a computer bank they've got my name, birthdate, address, phone number and time my shot was delivered. I made a point to look everybody in the eye and thank them along the way, from the first wayside check-in to the dude who administered the stick when I got to the end of the line and rolled down the window. I didn't actually say "thanks for quite possibly saving my life" but that was sure as hell the point I was trying to make.

As you pulled out at the other end of the garage after getting your shot they made you park in a big lot on the far side and wait for 10 minutes to see if anybody had a serious reaction - a rare, very rare event - before they got back on the road. It took me about two hours to get the shot, start to finish.

And that's the story of the most important drive-in I've ever been to.

I've heard just a very few stories of soreness and headaches or fatigue post-shot -- but it's been four hours now since I got home and other than just a wee bit of stiffness in the arm and the typical soreness in my shoulder around the muscle where I got the shot, I've had no reaction -- well not unless you call a great sigh of relief a reaction.

As you know it takes a couple of weeks for the t-lymphocytes and antibodies to get the message and start doing their thing and even then you only get about 50% immunity from that first shot; it's not until after the second shot, which I'll go back for in three weeks, that it gradually builds up to 95% or somewhere in that neighborhood. And even then you're advised to continue wearing masks to protect others in case you have unknowingly contracted a light load of the virus prior to your shot or shortly afterwards - and are asymptomatic and therefore, theoretically, a potential carrier who can unwittingly "shed" the virus with a sneeze or whatever and give it to others. Sounds like a remote possibility to me but I'll do as I'm told.

I say all this and post it for the benefit of our classmates, knowing that when you read it, Jim, you'll correct any layman errors I have made.

01/25/21 12:45 PM

#8898

Joseph D. McCarthy

At this point I have only two things to say.

For any of you that feel that any of my postings offended you, "I'm sorry about what I said when I was hungry."

Second: "I don't care what anyone thinks of me. Except dogs, I want dogs to like me."

Have a wonderful day; if that doesn't offend anyone.

Oh lighten uo, it's a joke.

Joe

01/25/21 12:48 PM

#8899

To my way of thinking, Religion and Politics can make for a dangerous mix.

What disturbs me (acually, scares the livin' bejesus out of me) is when American Christians, or may I call them "psuedo-christians", (there is a difference - read; self righteous, holier-than-thou, finger pointing) zealots attach a level of divinity to political figures - or any popular social figures for that matter.

We all know people in the public eye (and I know some personally in my church) who refer to certain figures as "God -sent", or "on a mission from God". We sure heard it in these last four years - Franklin Graham, Pat Roberson, Robert Jeffress, and Paula White, one of those "Prosperity Theology" preachers who, I believe are as far off base as anything I have heard in my life time.

And we've long done this in the Catholic church. Remember those 5th grade Baltimore Catechism questions about the Cathoilic Church being "the one true church". (back when we spoke abput some of us having non-Catholic parents)

So easy to get lost in traditon, philosophy, dogma, and ceremony - even Theology. Who's right and who's wrong? Who knows better? Who has the correct answer?

But I don't worship a philospohy, a history, a set of rules - and certainly not a Pope, or a bishop, or a priest. And I don't worship a "religion". I think all that misses the point.

I am one of those who believes that Christ came to free us from "religion". His message is about Hope, Renewal, Forgiveness, and Love - not about winning.

We can argue politics all day long (and I obviously love to). And yes, we should apply some moral standards to the candidates and issues. But placing a mantle of divinity around our politicians shoulders is very frightening.

We needn't worry that Jesus never ran in a primary, or never attended a single fund raiser. But we should never forget that when they came to get Him, he never raised a finger to stop them.

01/25/21 12:53 PM

#8900

Joe,

Though I loved his comedy, you and I would take umbrage with the great W.C. Fields, who once said, "A man who hates dogs and babies can't be all bad."

The trouble with dogs is that we fall in love with them.

01/25/21 06:52 PM

#8901