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09/25/20 11:14 PM #8125    

 

Frank Ganley

Tim LaVelle, the night I called and you hung up , you missed an amazing concert from my band " The Old Man Jam Band! Our drummer Joe had just started playing "wipe out" and I recounted the story of our sword fight in biology class! That of course inspired me to call you. As I promised nothing political but you missed a spectacular rendition of tiki bar by John hiatt. Answer your phone 

FRank


09/25/20 11:58 PM #8126    

 

Michael McLeod

Jim: I'm hoping for the funny pages.

And continuing with my theme of separating fact from fiction and finding trustworthy sources here is a story from the New York Times about the balloting questions and supposed past mistakes that are being promulgated by the Trump camp.

Note that the story includes hyperlink to numerous studies. 

  •  

If you are among the tens of millions of Americans who intend to vote by mail this year, you’re facing a deluge of misinformation about the integrity of that voting method.

Much of it is coming from President Trump, who has repeatedly attacked state efforts to expand voting by mail. He uses language meant to discourage it, mischaracterizing mail-in ballots as “dangerous,” “unconstitutional,” “a scam” or rife with “fraud.”

His comments are not true. There have been numerous independent studies and government reviews finding voter fraud extremely rare in all forms, including mail-in voting. The president is making these claims to lay the groundwork for possibly not accepting the voting results, going so far as refusing to commit to a peaceful transfer of power if he loses.

Here’s a fact check to help debunk some of the common misperceptions and falsehoods.

Absentee ballots are more secure than mail-in ballots. False.

Mr. Trump, in explaining why he favored mail ballots in one state and not in another, has claimed that states like Florida — where he himself has voted by mail — are more secure because they use “absentee ballots” rather than mail-in ballots. (The state itself refers to them as “vote-by-mail ballots.”)

 

There have also been viral Twitter posts claiming that mail-in ballots cannot be “verified,” pose a greater threat to election integrity than “absentee ballots” or are not handled through a “chain of custody,” meaning they are not properly tracked.

Despite these claims, which sound consequential, there is no meaningful difference between “absentee ballots” and “vote-by-mail ballots.” The terms are often used interchangeably. Moreover, they are both secure forms of voting.

In terms of security, both mail-in and absentee ballots are paper ballots hand-marked by the voter, which the National Conference of State Legislatures considers the “gold standard of election security.” Forty-four states have signature verification protocols for mail ballots.

Because some states will automatically send mail-in ballots to registered voters, Mr. Trump sought to draw another misleading distinction. He claimed Democrats were “cheating” by mailing what he called “unsolicited ballots,” tweeting: “Sending out 80 MILLION BALLOTS to people who aren’t even asking for a ballot is unfair and a total fraud in the making.”

Ahead of the election, nine states and Washington, D.C., will indeed automatically mail ballots to voters — but only to those who are registered and not, as Mr. Trump has said, to “anybody in California that’s breathing,” “people that aren’t citizens” or “people that don’t even know what a ballot is.” Those automatic ballots will reach 44 million voters — not 80 million — including in the heavily Republican state of Utah, as well as Washington, which has a Republican secretary of state overseeing the election.

In August, some of Mr. Trump’s supporters and family members began circulating misleading claims that “846 dead people tried to vote in Michigan’s primary,” pointing to a news release by Michigan’s secretary of state to suggest that there had been a scheme by voters to cast ballots on behalf of the deceased. But the release itself did not say this, and had only pointed out that there were 846 “voters who died after casting their absentee ballot but before Election Day.”

Similarly, a Facebook post that has since amassed over 100,000 shares, likes and comments — and has been repeated by the president — falsely claimed “500,000 mail in ballots found in Virginia and 200,000 in Nevada with dead peoples names and pets.”

What had occurred was that a nonprofit in Virginia sent out 500,000 ballot applications with a wrong address on the return envelopes. In a story about the mistake, a local radio station quoted the leader of another civic organization as saying “one person stated that a dead person received one and a pet received one.” Similarly, a conservative legal group found that during primary elections in June, two counties in Nevada sent out more than 250,000 ballots that were undeliverable because of outdated or wrong addresses.

In buttressing his claim that mail ballots are not secure, Mr. Trump has repeatedly said that a friend in Westchester County, N.Y., received a ballot for his deceased son. This is improbable as New York is one of seven states that require voters to have a reason to request and vote by an absentee ballot; it is not mailing out ballots to voters unprompted.

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As for pets voting? A database of proven election fraud cases maintained by the Heritage Foundation, a conservative think tank, includes just one example of a woman requesting and then casting an absentee ballot for her dog. That database also notes that since 1991, there have been only 11 cases where someone filled out an absentee ballot on behalf of a dead person.

Continue reading the main story

Mail-in ballots will lead to a ‘rigged’ election. False.

Numerous studies have found little evidence that mail-in ballots help one party over another. Of the 16 states where more than half of voters voted by mail in the last presidential election, Mr. Trump won nine. Several Republican states like Iowa, Missouri and Alabama have expanded mail-in ballots this year.

And yet, Mr. Trump continues to claim, without evidence, that “Democrats are also trying to rig the election by sending out tens of millions of mail-in ballots” or that “they’re not sending them to Republican neighborhoods.”

Nevada and its election system, in particular, has become a target, particularly after Gov. Steve Sisolak blocked plans for the Trump campaign to hold an outdoor rally in the state. Mr. Trump has falsely claimed 14 times that Nevada officials “don’t even want verification of the signature” (they do) and seven times that Mr. Sisolak was “in charge of ballots” and therefore “can rig the election” (the Republican secretary of state supervises elections, and local officials handle the ballots).

The president’s unfounded suspicions that mail-in voting harms Republicans have been further amplified online with viral posts claiming that a “Trump Landslide Will Be Flipped By Mail-In Votes Emerging A Week After Election Day.” These claims were based on misconstruing the findings of a Democratic data and analytics firm. The firm’s chief executive had simply warned that in-person voting by Republicans would create a “mirage” of Mr. Trump leading on election night, but that results could change once “every legitimate vote is tallied.”

But there was this one time.…

With election officials running thousands of local, state and national elections, mistakes are bound to happen. These isolated incidents, however, are not evidence of widespread wrongdoing. But they can be taken out of context.

Last week, for example, Mr. Trump and others highlighted ballot printing and mailing errors that affected fewer than 1,000 ballots.

In Michigan, more than 400 ballots listed the wrong person as Mr. Trump’s running mate. The issue was fixed and alerted within two hours, and officials said the state would still accept any affected ballots that were returned. There is no evidence that the misprint was widespread or that the Democratic secretary of state had “purposely” printed the wrong name, as Mr. Trump claimed.

In another instance of error, Mecklenburg County, N.C., accidentally sent roughly 500 voters two ballots. Election officials said the mistake was unlikely to lead to double voting, as the ballots contained specific codes for each individual voter.

Even in the rare example where there was malfeasance, as there was during a May special election for seats on the City Council in Paterson, N.J., where four men were charged with fraud, Mr. Trump has exaggerated the situation nonetheless.

“In New Jersey, 20 percent of the ballots were defective, fraudulent, 20 percent,” he said at a rally in Pennsylvania in August. “And that’s because they did a good job. OK? So this is just a way they’re trying to steal the election and everybody knows that.”

The local board of elections in fact rejected 3,200 ballots or 19 percent — but not 23 percent30 percent or 40 percent, as Mr. Trump has gone on to claim. And those in both parties told The Washington Post that not all were fraudulent. Ballots can be disqualified for mismatched signatures or for other user errors.

Curious about the accuracy of a claim? Email factcheck@nytimes.com.


09/26/20 04:58 PM #8127    

 

Michael McLeod

Jim: You probably saw this already. But it's really interesting, and contradicts earlier theories about why kids and covid don't mix. 

https://stm.sciencemag.org/content/early/2020/09/21/scitranslmed.abd5487


09/26/20 06:45 PM #8128    

 

James Hamilton, M. D.

Mike McL.,

I had not seen that particular article but reports about it and other similar reports.

This virus is really making the medical world more knowledgable as well as more confused about the immune system. The more we learn, the more we need to learn.

It used to be medical knowledge and understanding changed maybe every few years. With COVID-19 that happens almost weekly. And people wonder why the medical information released to the public seems confusing! Hey, it confuses us doctors also!

Back in med school we used to joke that the same questions were on our exams that were there for the class one year ahead of us. The only thing that changed were the correct answers!

It seems that the microbes are always one step ahead of researchers and are winning. But I still have faith that we will conquer this pathogen. The question is "What's next"?.

Jim

 


09/27/20 11:54 AM #8129    

 

Michael McLeod

Jim: Well what you say is consistent with the very small window that opened up for me when I wrote that story several weeks ago and all the doctors kept on saying that this was indeed an utterly new and mystifying critter on the block.

On another front: I woke up this morning with the song, "Catch a Falling Star and Put it in Your Pocket" in my head.

I have not thought of or sung - well I never sang the damn thing - anyway there is no reason I can think of why that song would have been in my head at the moment my girlfriend called me and woke me up around ten oclock and hell yes I sleep late I'm frigging retired or at least semi retired.

What a crappy song. But more to the point how fascinating it is that our neurons, though resting, never stop firing away, they just do it in an utterly random way, calling upon the lord knows how many little info bits that we have in that awesome organ, which apparently continues chugging away like an idling engine at a stop sign while we sleep. 

Anybody else have a story about waking up with something weird and unaccountable on their mind?


09/27/20 01:24 PM #8130    

 

James Hamilton, M. D.

Mike,

Waking up with a song... a sure sign that you have been infected with an ear worm.surprise It has probably already burrowed deep into your brain and there is no known cure!crying

Jim


09/27/20 03:49 PM #8131    

 

Michael McLeod

I feel bad for the worm slim pickin's.


09/27/20 03:53 PM #8132    

 

John Jackson

Mike, I didn’t wake up with this but a couple of days ago, for the first time in many years,  I happened to think of the lunchtime offerings in the BWHS cafeteria which, I believe, were the same each week throughout our four years.  We started off the week (healthily) on Monday with hot dogs and then the offering for each succeeding day incorporated the leftovers from the previous day (except for Friday which, I think, was grilled cheese).  Can anyone name the lunchtime delicacies we were offered  for Tuesday-Thursday?


09/27/20 05:39 PM #8133    

 

Michael McLeod

Well obviously you can rule out hotdogs for Friday and I'm working with my ptsd therapist to remember whatever it was we had on Thursdays.  


09/27/20 05:53 PM #8134    

Mary Clare Hummer (Bauer)

I was a packer so I can't help you except I think they had something akin to a Wendy's frosty. Sometimes I would partake. Usually though, if I had a quarter to spend, I'd save it to splurge at Sandie's on the way home from school. Weren't the burgers 15¢?  Now THAT was some fine eating!!!  
🖐🤚      😷

Clare


09/27/20 09:54 PM #8135    

 

John Jackson

Now we know why Trump, alone among Republican or Democratic presidential  candidates over the past 40 years, has not released his federal tax returns.  The New York Times has obtained his tax returns for the past 20+ years and these are the takeaways for this titan of American business (italics are direct quotes from NYT article):

The Times has obtained Donald Trump’s tax information extending over more than two decades, revealing struggling properties, vast write-offs, an audit battle and hundreds of millions in debt.

Mr. Trump paid no federal income taxes in 11 of 18 years that The Times examined. In 2017, after he became president, his tax bill was only $750.

He has reduced his tax bill with questionable measures, including a $72.9 million tax refund that is the subject of an audit by the Internal Revenue Service.

Many of his signature businesses, including his golf courses, report losing large amounts of money — losses that have helped him to lower his taxes.

The financial pressure on him is increasing as hundreds of millions of dollars in loans he personally guaranteed are soon coming due.

Even while declaring losses, he has managed to enjoy a lavish lifestyle by taking tax deductions on what most people would consider personal expenses, including residences, aircraft and $70,000 in hairstyling for television.

Of course his defenders will initially say it's fake news, but before long they'll be forced to do damage control  by saying  only suckers pay taxes (kind of like the suckers and losers who came ashore in the first wave at Normandy in 1944).

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/09/27/us/trump-taxes-takeaways.html

 


09/27/20 11:08 PM #8136    

 

Joseph D. McCarthy

Since I know the question will come up.

Just a quick note before you start reading, or hearing, that the President's tax return's were leaked by an employ of the I.R.S..  Attempting to access tax returns without authorization from on TOP of any person in the public eye will immediately result in arrest.  Followed by a trial, then loss of any pension before jail time AND a hefty fine.

Second, try not to believe any conspirancy type theory that the U.S. Government has a twenty Trillion slush fund to cover all of the warehouses buried in Utah to store everyone's tax returns for the past 100 plus years.  The only tax returns that are maintained for ever are the tax returns for the period that a person is Actually in office as the president.  Those are maintained in Washington, DC, not Mossyport. 

After  you file your, paper, tax return it is input by clerks into what is considered "Transcript" form.  An electronically filed returnn automatically ends in "Transcript" form.  The original returns are maintained in Service Centers for a period of THREE years then normally destroyed, and all that remains is the "Transcript" in electronic form.  

So, an I.R.S. employee who tried to obtain over ten years worth of returns would not only be unable, but the attempt to input requests would send off ALARMS.  

This leads to the question of who would have actual hard copies of all those returns.  First, would be employees of the accounting firm that does the bookkeeping and prepares the actual returns.  Second, would be the banks that do business with a person by way of loans.  Last might be others who provided loans or other financial dealings with a taxpayer.  This is similar to each of you at some time in your life giving a financial institution, bank or other, authorization to your tax returns when you borrowed to purchase a home.

I hope this has totally confused you, err I mean provided some understaning.

And yes, I have been audited a number of times, and hate to say it but received SMALL refunds.

Joe


09/28/20 03:19 AM #8137    

 

David Mitchell

Joe and John,

This is indeed very confusing. If you are correct Joe, (and you should know) then where does all this information that the NY Times reports come from?

 

Meanwhile, in a realted story, there is a short video documentary about a team of financial investigators on the NY Times staff that has obtained and sorted thousands of pages of Trump's family "trust" finances (which I believe are available on pubic record), detailing some of the many years of illegally "funneling" money from the father to his five(?) children (Donald and two sisters and two brothers if I am correct). One of the "accounting methods" is so simple and bold that it defies imaginattion.

If I can sort of summarize (and I am open to correction on this); It was a simple process of one of the family trusts buying tens (maybe hundreds) of millions of dollars worth of replacement equipment for all their many real estate holdings (elevators, heating and air conditioning units, all sorts of expensive equipment) and selling it at enormous markups to another of the the familiy's real estate trusts. The children pocket the profit on the sale and the equipment goes on the books at highy inflated values for much greater deprecition write-offs.

There was a lot more to this report. That was the part that caught my attention. Perhaps this is all part of the same investigation from the NY Times.

NOTE: If I can find this viedeo I will post it. It's been a while since I first saw it. This team at NY Times has thousands of pages of documents and have been piecing it together for several years - since before the election if I recall correctly.

 

And don't even get me started on what I found as I drilled deeply into the "Trump Univesrsity" lawsuit case (a while back). That story seems to have gone away since he settled just before the election. I seemed to me that he had to settle that one, or the bad publicity would have cost him the election. It was simply blatant naked fraud, done on such a shallow and transparent manner I could hardly believe anyone could be that dumb - or that bold - or both.


09/28/20 09:08 AM #8138    

 

David Barbour

What we want to know Joe is are you still in your house?  Do you still have a house.  The meager

maps I have this morning make the fire still far from you.  But my friend in Napa is close to the Glass fire 

and I'm worried for them.  Also worried for a friend in Santa Rosa, heck, might as well include you.  I'm just

worried.  Let us know you're okay.

DB


09/28/20 02:10 PM #8139    

 

John Jackson

Clare, you were a packer for good reason.  I mostly brought my lunch but occasionally bought.  Here was the BWHS cafeteria lineup:

   Monday: hot dogs

   Tuesday: hamburgers with Monday’s leftover hot dogs ground up and added.

   Wednesday: Meat loaf (made in part with Tuesday’s leftover hamburgers)

   Thursday: chili (including  – you guessed it!)

   Friday: grilled cheese

I think it was the same every week for our four years although Vatican II was over by our senior year and we may have gotten some variety on Fridays.

Urban legend you say?   I think not – I especially remember how strange the hamburgers tasted...


09/28/20 03:15 PM #8140    

 

James Hamilton, M. D.

I also brown bagged my lunch, often baloney or PB&J.

Certainly by today's knowledge and standards, that Watterson luncheon menu - or my packed food - was unhealthy, to say the least. But in those days I doubt schools hired nutritionists.

And as kids of that era, we played hard and physically as opposed to sitting and playing computer simulation games.

Medical science in the field of lipid disorders and pathology was in its infancy, cholesterol levels were seldom routinely measured in adults let alone children and teens, LDL was just beginning to be investigated and "normal" cholesterol levels were thought by some to be up to maybe 250. Even if extremely lipemic patients were diagnosed, treatment options were minimal, had often intolerable side effects and not very effective. Atherosclerotic diseases such as heart attacks and strokes were treated (usually with 3 week hospitalizations) rather than prevented as we do today with medications, diets, healthy lifestyles, vascular stents and  surgery.

Yet most of us survived those lunches and those trips to Sandy's (which was also my choice for a pre-dinner "snack") on my way home after school.

And, at our age, I'll eat my bran but still pass on kale and quinoa! 

Jim 

 

 


09/28/20 03:45 PM #8141    

Timothy Lavelle

I wonder, does anyone know how Phil Enright is doing? Clare's mention of Sandy's took me way back. I don't know how but Enwrong roped me into picking him up before school. That required sitting in the tiny car waiting in front of his house...then tapping lightly on the front door...then opening that unanswered door and prowling thru his haunted house to find him in the upstairs bathroom, staring dumbly into the vanity mirror, shaving with a cigarette in his mouth. It was like visiting with a 40 year old man even then. I swear his beard grew back in while he shaved!

We would both climb into that tiny car I had with little or no heat and off we went. 

There was a donut shop on High that some guys would stop at before school to make the momentus choice of whether to skip or not. Maybe that choice was just mine. Kevin Cull might remember that shop. I hope Phil is doing okay. Pretty sure he came from a different dimension...


09/28/20 04:14 PM #8142    

 

David Mitchell

Tim,

I'm curious to know whereabouts on High Street?

If it was down in Clintonville on the west side of the street (somehwere south of E. North Broadway) it might have been "Ellek's"(spelling?) Bakery. A Yugoslavian couple who turned out the best bread, sweet rolls, cakes, and doughnuts this side of Saturn. I was fortunate to have been spared a life of Wonder Bread. Or even, "the Omar Man".

It was Eleck's bread in my lunch sandwiches - those same old Peanut Butter and Butter (NOT PPJ's - that was too eccentric for me) and baloney, or turkey sandwiches. Some times it was a cold chicken leg or thigh. My mother argued - in vain - to get them to offer better food varieties in the lunchroom. When she failed, she swore not to volunteer to work in the kitchen nor let me eat that food. 

And as for Sandy's - - ahh what a memory! I had to walk home the opposite direction (down those steep Cooke Road hills to Overbrook and up the hill on Yaronia. But I loved heading down to Sandy's after school for a hamburger and a coke -  and that wonderful social gathering. It couldn't get much better than that!

 


09/28/20 05:37 PM #8143    

 

Michael McLeod

Love the reminiscing.

And Jim I have often thought of how much longer my two grandfathers and father would have lived had the pills I take for high cholesteral and high blood pressure - and the education I have gotten about diet - had been available to them. All three died from what was then called hardening of the arteries.I'm grateful for the extra decade of life I'm likely to get, fingers crossed, compared to my pop. 

Dave, my compliments for the reading you are doing.

I have subscriptions to the New Yorker, the New York Times, and the Washingon Post, all fairly reasonable, and all doing Pulitzer level journalism these days. It's basically like shopping in stores I trust.  But you can cruise the web and find good (and bad) stories about what's going on from a variety of sources. If there is one thing I assume we can all agree upon it is that the country, and I'd say the world, is at a historic crossroads. So there's no shortage of high-stakes issues to explore, whatever your philosophical bent.

Meanwhile I have decided to assign my writing class to do a paper about the parallels between pandemics over the eras. Some very interesting material there to explore. 

 

 

 

 


09/28/20 05:59 PM #8144    

 

James Hamilton, M. D.

Tim,  

Donut shop on SE corner of Torrence and High Street was Capitol Donuts. That may be the one of which you you were thinking. 

Jim 


09/28/20 06:28 PM #8145    

Mary Clare Hummer (Bauer)

Bakeries must have been the forerunner of Starbucks.  I remember the one south of EN Broadway and have no recollection of the one at Torrence. But you're forgetting the best one of all--the Clintonville Bakery, located between Oakland Park & Dunedin on the east side of High. Best glazed donuts ever for 5¢!!! (We only got to have them on Saturdays occasionally so skipping school never occurred to me.) And I forget where McLeod's donuts he would steal came from but it must have been up on Indianola in the IC parish bounds. 
🖐🤚       😷

Clare


09/28/20 07:57 PM #8146    

 

Joseph D. McCarthy

Last night my wife and I went out for a big lobster dinner at the Indian Casino near us.  This morninng I was looking forward to I.H.O.P., there are no V.I.P. (Village Inn Pancakes) or Waffle House nearby;  then I woke up from my dream, and looked out the window to see Brown clouds and falling flakes of white/gray ash from the fire that started  near Calistoga, CA.  There was a series called Falcon Crest on TV many years ago.  It was filmed in Calistoga.  I passed it many times on my way to teach evening classes at the Napa Junior College.

Dave I tried to make my earlier post difficult on purpose, but in the last full paragraph I tried to state that the tax returns, paper copies, are maintained by accounting firms as long as you are a client.  Tax returns are also maintained by financial firms, who make any loans, generally till a few years after a loan is paid off.  However, from a recent release of info it APPEARS AS IF IT MAY HAVE BEEN AN inside JOB.  tIME WILL TELL.

As to how we are fairing with the latest fire.  So far so good.  Mark check me on this, but I remember a film (British?) "A Man Climbed a Hill and Came down a Mountain."  Well I am just a couple of Hills, many people call them mountains, away from the latest raging fire.  They have evacuated a couple of areas just East of Santa Rosa, and if it kkeeps moving in the same direction we may be told within a day or two to evacuate.

On the bright side.  After waiting over a week, my new printer arrived and after some (@$#@%@@^^) I have it working.   My one printer "misplaced" its printhead a stopped working.  I had a spare and set it up to find that it was printing only every other line or so (and that after spending over $100 on new ink cartridges that I installed to find out that didn't solve anything other than my wasting some money.

I'm looking forward to tomorrow.

Joe

 


09/28/20 08:40 PM #8147    

Timothy Lavelle

Oh my god.....oooooo my god.....Joe, fingers crossed for you and Thank You sooo much.

It's "Time will tell"!

All my life I thought it was "Tim will tell" and have been sooo very talkative because....

If you were believing that, I have a course online, stupid humor 101, that you really need.

Yeah Jim. Capitol Donuts. And Clare, girl, there is NO donut that beats the "Do I make homeroom on time or go to Old Man's Cave donut". So much angst, so many excuses for Baby Baer to forge!

But....Phil Enright anyone?


09/28/20 11:09 PM #8148    

 

Michael McLeod

Mary Clare:

I stole donuts from the Omar warehouse and distribution center on Oakland Park between Indianola and the railroad tracks, where donuts and bread and whatever else was delivered from their bakery. From the bedroom of my home on East North Broadway I could see the trucks deliver a load at night, and there was a lapse of time between when the big delivery truck would back up to the warehouse with its load and the time when the crew would arrive to unload the truck.  For some reason or other the sliding back door of the truck was always left open, and there was just enough of a space between the building and the back of the truck that I could climb right in and grab a couple of boxes of donuts from the stacks of rectangular wire trays filled with bread, rolls and other baked goods your neighborhood Omar man - "ma! hey ma! here comes the Omar man! - would deliver the next morning.

That's how gangsta I was. Not like I was some cheap-ass juvenile delinquent grabbing a Superman comic book from Steve Brody's drug story. I had better game than that. And then to top it all off I did an occasional good deed ala Robin Hood by taking a dozen stolen donuts down to the unwitting nuns at the IC nunnery on East North Broadway every now and then, which is bound to get me time off in purgatory. Winning!

.

 


09/29/20 09:56 AM #8149    

 

Michael McLeod

As a preview for tonight's debate from the Washington Post's fact-checker team, a cool summation of the political bs on both sides. This is also part of my ongoing promise to provide strategies for telling truth from fiction in our confusing, wild wild west infowars world. A story with hyperlinks to multiple sources is likely to be more accurate and credible than one that relies on a narrow field of opinions and a low count of credible sources.

 

Both President Trump and former vice president Joe Biden enter Tuesday night’s debate with histories of making false, misleading or exaggerated statements, often well-documented by The Fact Checker.

Biden’s first presidential campaign in 1987 imploded after charges of plagiarism and false claims about his academic record. Trump, from his first appearance in the media nearly half a century ago, has routinely embellished and misled about his achievements and finances. As president, Trump has made more than 20,000 false or misleading statements, according to The Fact Checker’s database.

But not all falsehoods are equal, and there are significant differences between the two men in how they mangle the facts. Here’s the tale of the tape in how Trump and Biden measure up before their first presidential debate.

Biden

Biden, with nearly a half century in politics, is an old-fashioned politician. He is prone to exaggeration and not often precise about policy issues, in contrast to more disciplined politicians like former president Barack Obama or former Florida governor Jeb Bush. Biden especially gets in trouble because of his loquacious nature, though he has tried to rein in his stemwinders during this presidential run. He often indicates he is knowledgeable about complex policy issues.

AD

Many of Biden’s factual errors are dismissed as “gaffes,” innocent mess-ups. In a recent interview with CNNJill Biden, his wife, sought to dismiss the issue: “After Donald Trump, you cannot even say the word gaffe.”

But it’s more than just gaffes. Here are some prime examples of Biden falsehoods.

Dubious numbers

Biden does not always get the numbers right.

In one famous example as vice president, Biden in 2011 touted an Obama-era jobs bill by claiming the number of rapes in Flint, Mich., had, depending on the hour, doubled, tripled and even quadrupled because the number of police had been reduced. There was no evidence to support any of these statistics, earning him Four Pinocchios and an editorial in the Delaware County Daily Times titled “Biden plays fast and loose with the facts.”

More recently, while running for president, Biden has falsely claimed that if Trump had handled the coronavirus pandemic properly, everyone who had died in the United States would be alive (there is no data to support this), that the trade deficit with China has never been higher (it has dropped in the last two years) and that Trump has never condemned white supremacists (Trump has, even as he mitigated it with his “both sides” comment). Biden also routinely inflates numbers, such as saying Trump admitted to Washington Post associate editor Bob Woodward that covid-19 was seven times more contagious than the flu, when in fact Trump had said five times.

AD

Garbled messaging

Biden’s talking points sometimes get mangled together. After an attack on the Medicare-for-all plan promoted by Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) during the primaries, Biden’s staff admitted:

  • He meant to say the plan would double the federal budget, except for interest on the debt, not that it was twice the federal budget.
  • He meant to say a tax on employers was like a deductible from your paycheck, not a deductible for your income tax.
  • He meant to say the employer tax was 7.5 percent, not “5 percent and 4 percent.”

During another debate, Biden falsely said more than 90 percent of the American people believe we have to get assault weapons off the street. Support for banning the sale of assault weapons usually ranges from 50 to 60 percent in recent surveys. Biden mixed up the statistics for polling on expanding background checks, which does get support in the 90 percent range.

Biden even attacked Trump once for fingerprinting food stamp recipients — when he meant to refer to former New York mayor Mike Bloomberg.

Revisionist history

Few politicians like to admit error. Biden handles it by offering a revisionist history that obscures his original policy position.

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In trying to explain his vote in favor of the 2003 invasion of Iraq, Biden has claimed that President George W. Bush misled him — which a Bush spokesman denies — and that he opposed the war from “the moment it started.” Actually, for more than a year, Biden repeatedly defended his vote to authorize an invasion as “just” and “right.” After The Fact Checker pointed that out, Biden said he “misspoke.”

Similarly, Biden’s explanation of his advice to Obama on whether to authorize the mission to kill Osama bin Laden has evolved over time. He initially said he urged Obama to not go and take more time to gather intelligence, but now he says he privately urged Obama to go. But that has not been confirmed by Obama.

Biden’s involvement in the civil rights movement, in his retelling, also has grown more expansive over time. Campaigning this year, Biden suggested he walked out of restaurants and picketed movie theaters. As far as we could determine, Biden participated in just one walkout at one restaurant. He also picketed a segregated movie theater.

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Since the emergence of the novel coronavirus, Biden has often oversold what he wrote in a late January opinion article for USA Today, claiming he said it was a pandemic. The USA Today piece is more of an attack on Trump and a recollection of Obama administration steps taken against the 2014 Ebola outbreak than a detailed plan for action against a possible pandemic. But at the same time, Biden indicated he took the threat seriously, even if he did not explicitly say a pandemic was on the way.

Invented tales

Biden sometimes tells stories that appear to have little basis in reality.

Earlier this year, Biden told voters at least three times that he was arrested in South Africa while trying to visit Nelson Mandela in Soweto. Mandela, later president of South Africa, was imprisoned on Robben Island at the time, making the whole story an impossibility. Eventually, the campaign said Biden was separated from the Congressional Black Caucus members he was traveling with at an airport, but that did not make much sense, either. (Another White member of Congress said it did not happen.)

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Last year, Biden told a moving tale of visiting Afghanistan and pinning a medal on a regretful soldier that jumbled elements of at least three actual events into one story. “In the space of three minutes, Biden got the time period, the location, the heroic act, the type of medal, the military branch and the rank of the recipient wrong, as well as his own role in the ceremony,” The Washington Post reported.

Nasty personal attacks

Biden will fault what he views as policy mistakes, but generally he does not make nasty personal attacks based on falsehoods.

Trump

The president comes from real estate background where what he once called “truthful hyperbole” is regarded as the norm. While in office, he has told dozens of falsehoods and misleading statements almost every day — in news conferences, prepared speeches, interviews and remarks to the media.

 

Biden makes mistakes and tells tall tales, but he often drops them or withdraws them if his error is highlighted in the media. Trump, by contrast, doubles down and repeats the false claim over and over. Indeed, when challenged with irrefutable evidence that his statement is wrong, Trump will grasp at the flimsiest pieces of evidence to insist he is right, even if the evidence contradicts or undermines what he had originally claimed.

We can only scratch the surface of Trump’s propensity for falsehoods in this article — The Fact Checker published a best-selling book on them — but here are some highlights. One of Trump’s biggest problems is that his knowledge of policy details is thin, so he often falls back on the same old spin when the questions try to probe deeper.

Dubious numbers

Trump exaggerates about just about everything.

 

He falsely claims (hundreds of times) that before the pandemic, he built the greatest economy in U.S. history; even at its best under Trump, it was not as good as the U.S. economy in the 1950s, 1960s or 1980s, and it was already beginning to stumble when the pandemic arrived. He says he passed the biggest tax cut in U.S. history, but it ranks eighth. He says he scored massive job-creating deals with Saudi Arabia, but the numbers are wildly inflated (and the jobs are mostly in Saudi Arabia).

Trump routinely cites statistics on immigration enforcement but flips the script depending whether border apprehensions are going up (“so many people arrested”) or going down (“so few people are crossing”).

Trump has played similar games with economic statistics. In Trump’s version of history, he “inherited a mess” with “millions of people out there” seeking jobs, whereupon he “accomplished an economic turnaround of historical proportions.” But it was Obama who inherited an economic crisis, with the country shedding 800,000 jobs a month when he took office in 2009. Eight years later, Trump took over when the economy was adding about 200,000 jobs a month — as it continued to do through his first three years.

 

Even after nearly four years as president, Trump appears to have little idea of how NATO is funded and operates. He repeatedly claimed other members of the alliance “owed” money to the United States and they were delinquent in their payments. Then he claimed credit for the money “pouring in” as a result of his jawboning, even though much of the increase in those countries’ spending on their own defense had been set under guidelines arranged during the Obama administration. Trump has touted new NATO funding numbers that are fanciful — and has given himself all of the credit for the increase.

Garbled messaging

Trump remains relentlessly on message, repeating his false claims over and over, so he does not often mangle his talking points as much as Biden. But Trump does often speak in discursive, meandering monologues, making his meaning unclear. He is also often flippant. That sometimes gives him plausible deniability or allows him to claim that he was only joking.

Revisionist history

Trump never admits he made a mistake, and he often spins fairy tales that have little basis in reality.

For instance, he repeatedly claims he got his start in business with only a $1 million loan from his father, which he then turned into a $10 billion empire. Not only is his reported wealth dubious, but also, after examining more than 100,000 confidential documents, the New York Times concluded that Fred Trump’s “small loan” was $60.7 million, or $140 million in 2018 dollars, much of which was never repaid. In all, the Times found that Trump received the equivalent of at least $413 million in today’s dollars from his father’s real estate empire.

Trump’s biggest domestic defeat of his presidency was his failed drive to repeal the Affordable Care Act. The effort that collapsed in the Senate would have weakened a key tenet of Obamacare: protections for people with preexisting health conditions. After that defeat, Trump’s rhetoric shifted: He falsely asserted more than 100 times that Republicans had protected people with preexisting conditions. In 2020, he even tweeted, “I was the person who saved Pre-Existing Conditions in your Healthcare.” He recently signed an executive order that he claimed would protect preexisting conditions. But he has never offered a plan that would do so and repeatedly claimed (falsely) he effectively eliminated Obamacare.

Similarly, one of Trump’s most famous campaign promises was that Mexico would pay for the border barrier he is building along the southern border. Not only did Trump redirect billions of dollars from military projects over the objections of Congress, but he keeps asserting that Mexico will pay for the wall in some mysterious fashion (such as through a trade deal or possibly adding toll booths at the border).

In battling the coronavirus pandemic, Trump has repeatedly tried to erase his original lackadaisical response with a story of how he took bold action against China with a travel ban opposed by all of his advisers. But Trump’s advisers pressed him to impose the ban, while he was initially skeptical, and the less-than-total ban came as many flights already were canceled and other countries were taking similar actions. Then Trump made the World Health Organization a scapegoat even though he had initially praised WHO’s efforts to stem the disease.

Invented tales

Trump frequently promotes conspiracy theories and asserts claims that have no basis in reality.

Some of Trump’s stories are simply puzzling. Trump on four separate occasions has falsely asserted that Obama had such a bad relationship with the Philippines that the country’s leaders would not let him land his presidential jet during an official visit, leaving him circling above the airport. Obama actually made two visits where he was warmly received.

Trump repeatedly said U.S. Steel was building six to eight new steel plants, but that wasn’t true. He said that as president, Obama gave citizenship to 2,500 Iranians during the nuclear-deal negotiations. It didn’t happen. Over and over, Trump claimed the Uzbekistan-born man who in 2017 was accused of killing eight people with a pickup truck in New York had brought two dozen relatives to the United States through chain migration. The actual number is zero.

But Trump’s tall tales also can be more nefarious. Trump has concocted conspiracy theories about Obama allegedly spying on his campaign, which he sometimes labels “Obamagate.” It started with Trump’s false claim in 2017 that Obama put a wiretap on him. Then that merged with a report that an FBI informant in Europe, a professor named Stefan Halper, met with at least three people working on the Trump campaign in Europe. A former campaign aide, Carter Page, was subject to an FBI warrant. Now Trump is focused on a January 2017 meeting Obama held in the Oval Office. Somehow, without much explanation, Trump has turned this meeting into a high crime that he considers to be treason.

Similarly, as the election has neared and Trump remains behind in the polls, the president has promoted bogus claims about the dangers of voting by mail. He also, without evidence, has claimed Biden must be on performance-enhancing drugs.

Nasty personal attacks

If Trump believes someone has crossed him, he will respond with a tsunami of untruths. His behavior is highly unusual for a politician, let alone a president. Without even a bit of humor, Trump lobs insults filled with falsehoods, changes history to denigrate opponents and fabricates tall tales about his foes out of whole cloth.

The examples are too numerous to mention and are probably familiar to readers. Trump falsely accused Rep. Ilhan Omar (D) of Minnesota of supporting the terrorist group behind the 9/11 attacks. He smeared Sen. Richard Blumenthal (D-Conn.) as “Danang Richard,” even though Blumenthal never described himself as a war hero in Vietnam or claimed to have fought in Danang. Trump invented a story about House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) “dancing in the streets” of Chinatown as the coronavirus emerged, saying she was responsible for “many deaths.” (Not only did Pelosi take the coronavirus more seriously than Trump, but San Francisco has had relatively few deaths.)

The Bottom Line

Both Biden and Trump have provided lots of fodder for fact-checkers. But Biden’s falsehoods tend to occur once — hence they are termed “gaffes” — or are withdrawn or dropped after criticism. Some of his errors are strange, but they generally do not have a nasty edge, and he does not engage in ad hominem attacks. Biden also exaggerates in broad strokes on complex policies to make himself appear smarter. Depending on your perspective, Biden is in the middleweight or welterweight class.

Trump, however, is the heavyweight champion of falsehoods. Trump repeats false statistics on everything, almost as if to will them to be facts. He frequently seems to inhabit a world of his own creation, spreading conspiracy theories and assuming the worst of his foes.

When the fact-checking is completed after tonight’s debate, it likely will not be scored as an even match.


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